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#1 6/4/09 7:34

Aiko
Member
From: NYC Metro Area
Registered: 18/1/07

Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Hello!!! It's been a while since I've posted.  I was playing "Rooftops" level and I had taken the elevator to the top level.  I used the SBG cannon on the fury with the weapon and I guess she fell down to the platform below. Wouldn't you know, I saw the elevator doors open and she walked out and back to her position!  Anyone ever notice that? Usually a fall means death but somehow she survived and used the elevator.


Aiko

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#2 6/4/09 8:22

Muro
Member
From: England
Registered: 28/5/08

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Haha thats pretty funny. I guess she may have chased you and the direction took her into the elevator.

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#3 10/4/09 20:52

love_Oni
Member
From: Da Nang, Vietnam
Registered: 10/5/08

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Amazing!


The Boy Who Knew Too Much tongue

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#4 10/4/09 21:36

Gumby
Member
From: Seattle, WA, USA
Registered: 30/8/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

I'm not quite sure how that would happen. By the game script, thats completely impossible. Where did you get your level scripts?


Iritscen: roll
Iritscen: it's amazing this program even works
Gumby: i know
Iritscen: and that statement applies to my code, not just yours

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#5 11/4/09 14:47

TOCS
Member
From: Denmark
Registered: 4/4/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

I'v tried this too, but you have to be insanely lucky to aquire that glitch.

This happend to me back in 2003, when i was still completing the game (i know it's a long time, took me 4 years, 2001 - 2004).

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#6 11/4/09 16:21

Gumby
Member
From: Seattle, WA, USA
Registered: 30/8/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

One of you: upload your GameDataFolder\IGMD\roof folder


Iritscen: roll
Iritscen: it's amazing this program even works
Gumby: i know
Iritscen: and that statement applies to my code, not just yours

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#7 12/4/09 10:26

jackoverfull
Member
From: San Mauro Torinese, Italy
Registered: 12/1/09
Website

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Behaviors like that (enemies fallen down in the void suddenly chasing me after a while coming out from apparently nowhere) happened to me several times in the past.

I used Oni on several macs (both classic and Cocoa versions), initially with the italian version, now with the english one (the italian one didn't play well with the cocoa version…), unmodified, with the edition or with titan, always happened. That may have something to do with the fact that i make the foes fall down in the void a lot.:/


"To the future, blinkin' an eye to the past!"

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#8 12/4/09 15:41

Gumby
Member
From: Seattle, WA, USA
Registered: 30/8/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Jack, that is probably just another enemy. While what Aiko and Rexxar are describing are possible with updates scripts that maybe not everybody has, what you are describing is impossible. hmm


Iritscen: roll
Iritscen: it's amazing this program even works
Gumby: i know
Iritscen: and that statement applies to my code, not just yours

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#9 12/4/09 15:57

jackoverfull
Member
From: San Mauro Torinese, Italy
Registered: 12/1/09
Website

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

In rooftops (it's not the only place where it happens, but it's the one in wich it happens mostly to me), it should be at the third savepoint, where there are a fury and a couple of strikers (maybe 3), one of wich with a Plasma Rifle, just after two ninjas (one comes down from the top, one in front of you) before the only guy with a Mercury Bow before the battle with mukade (yes, that place where you can get a shortcut if you manage to jump right on the left, next to the forcefield), if the fury or one of the strikers get down in the void it seems that they always (or at least "often") comes up from nowhere after some time. With or without any modification.


"To the future, blinkin' an eye to the past!"

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#10 13/4/09 3:50

TOCS
Member
From: Denmark
Registered: 4/4/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

It won't help uploading, as I'v reinstalled it several times.

It also was my dads pc, because i diden't had my own before 2004.

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#11 13/4/09 6:38

jackoverfull
Member
From: San Mauro Torinese, Italy
Registered: 12/1/09
Website

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

I can upload mine, but it's a standard install…


"To the future, blinkin' an eye to the past!"

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#12 13/4/09 8:14

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

I recreated jackoverfull's expeience several times last night.  Here's one example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZZvMldrjlY .  We're still trying to figure out how that's possible.

However, I am having a lot of trouble recreating Aiko's situation because it's so hard to blow the Fury at SP2 over the edge with those railings there.  I have a couple more ideas to try when I find the time, though.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#13 13/4/09 8:22

jackoverfull
Member
From: San Mauro Torinese, Italy
Registered: 12/1/09
Website

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Iritscen wrote:

I recreated jackoverfull's expeience several times last night.  Here's one example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZZvMldrjlY .  We're still trying to figure out how that's possible.

Yes, that's exactly what i meant. smile

And it is indeed strange: it is as if there is something down there that catches falling characters and move them on the other side of the building…:|


"To the future, blinkin' an eye to the past!"

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#14 13/4/09 10:07

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Although I'm not an expert in BSL, I certainly don't see any commands in the Rooftops scripts that would do that.  I can't help but wonder if there's something going on in one of the mysterious corners of the binary data that we don't understand.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#15 13/4/09 11:55

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

A trigger volume cause this issue (for team Syndicate), IMO.   > snapshot <

The fury's CHAR data doesn't provide a patrol path but BSL does. In your vid: she gets upstairs again (dopath ...) peacefully (ai2_forget ...)

Still, what made her teleport ? Another TV ? Doesn't look that way.  hmm



func void t84(string ai_name)
{
    dmsg "in"
    dprint checking
    go_hide2 =  go_hide2 + 1;
    sleep 60
    if(trigvolume_count (84) ne 0)
    {
        dprint t84
        if(go_hide2 eq 0)
        {
         ai2_makeignoreplayer (ai_name,1)
            ai2_dopath (ai_name,patrol_69)
            ai2_setjobstate (ai_name)
            ai2_forget (ai_name)
            sleep 60
            ai2_makeignoreplayer (ai_name,0)

        }
        [...]
    }
}

func void t84b(string ai_name)
{
    dmsg "out"
    dprint t84B
    go_hide2 =  go_hide2 - 1;
}

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#16 13/4/09 12:24

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

I noticed both that part of the script, and the odd behavior of the enemies where they seem to frequently run back to their posts, then turn around and see me and come back to attack me again, which is coming from this script.  But what is that all about?  What was the point of that scripting?

Still, what made her teleport ? Another TV ? Doesn't look that way.  hmm

That, my friend, is the real question here. smile


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#17 13/4/09 14:11

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

What was the point of that scripting?

Maybe to keep them away from the edge (and praying you follow them). ^^

There where a few mysterious debugger messages: b6r4of6 and b6r5of6.
But looks like a false track. debug_script.txt outputs stuff like this

"dprint"string: b6r4of6pushing context "particle"string: b06_rain3string: stoppushing context "particle"string: b06_rain4string: startpushing context "particle"string: b06_rain5string: stoppushing context "rain19"string: char_0pushing context "dprint"string: b6r5of6pushing context

However, I see hardly rain. Buffer overflow? Something corrupt?
I think it's a bug. Just like this: I turned on "cannttouchthis" when fighting these three guys and Konoko performed kick and punch on there own, no key pressed on my board... One more bug (teleporting chars) who cares ? ^^ Ahm...
Iritscen, how did you reproduce the teleporting fury? Maybe you can outline the conditions for this.

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#18 13/4/09 14:19

Phydur
Member
Registered: 13/1/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

i feel a little stupid in asking this, because I'm sure you'd have already done it if there was,
but is there a way to make the camera folow a bot? as if it was konoko? but without the control?
cause then you could simpily swich the camera to the fury and see what hapens.
but, of course, if you could do that, you already would have.
still I fiugre i was worth mentioning, since i havent posted anything in a while...


I intentionally spell dang, dange, FYI.

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#19 13/4/09 15:03

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

paradox-01 wrote:

What was the point of that scripting?

Maybe to keep them away from the edge (and praying you follow them). ^^

Ah, a simple explanation.  That could be it.

I think it's a bug. Just like this: I turned on "cannttouchthis" when fighting these three guys and Konoko performed kick and punch on there own, no key pressed on my board...

True.  It's just amazing if are we looking at a total coincidence here, don't you think?  Falling character gets magically transported to a safe place nearby after falling over an edge, then a script written to keep them from going over an edge causes them to go up the stairs so we realize it's the same character?  I can't help but wonder if this happens in other places and we've just never noticed.

Iritscen, how did you reproduce the teleporting fury? Maybe you can outline the conditions for this.

I didn't do anything special.  Just load up Rooftops SP3, get past the two ninjas, and climb up there and start throwing people towards the edge.  I usually turn on 'liveforever' so I can afford to get shot while I'm concentrating on leading the AI towards the ledge, but I've done it without any cheats turned on, too.  Also, sometimes it happens on my first try, sometimes not.  It works for me maybe 33% of the time.

Btw, jackoverfull, are you running Oni in Windows or the Mac OS?

Phydur wrote:

is there a way to make the camera folow a bot? as if it was konoko? but without the control?

Hi Phydur!  I was wondering about that too, but I personally don't know the answer.  But if we can get Oni to run in single-step mode, then control the camera manually, we should be able to track the AI as they fall, then, if they suddenly disappear, we could find where they went in the next frame before they start walking back to their post.  If I have the time later I can try it, but if someone else could instead, it would be much appreciated.

P.S.: I've gotten the Fury at SP2 (that Aiko was originally referring to in the OP) to fall down below, but the fall kills her even though I set her health really high.  Maybe if she clears the bottom platform and keeps falling, she will get teleported like the AIs at SP3, but I've only pulled that off once, and she didn't show up again.  However, the teleportation trick at SP3 doesn't work every time, so that doesn't mean much.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#20 13/4/09 19:24

jackoverfull
Member
From: San Mauro Torinese, Italy
Registered: 12/1/09
Website

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Iritscen wrote:

True.  It's just amazing if are we looking at a total coincidence here, don't you think?  Falling character gets magically transported to a safe place nearby after falling over an edge, then a script written to keep them from going over an edge causes them to go up the stairs so we realize it's the same character?  I can't help but wonder if this happens in other places and we've just never noticed.

I think that this happened to me in other places too, but i can't remember exactly where, sorry. By the way, this is surely the place where it happens more frequently.


Btw, jackoverfull, are you running Oni in Windows or the Mac OS?

Currently, mac os x (cocoa port with latest community patches), in the past i used the carbon port (initially in os x, then a lot in classic or in the classic inviroment), using the italian version of oni (the cocoa port works badly with it), some years passed, but i think that this happened already back then.


"To the future, blinkin' an eye to the past!"

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#21 13/4/09 19:29

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Hmm.  Aiko, aren't you playing on a Mac?  And has anyone else here been able to get the Fury or one of the Strikers that appear in my video to teleport like that?


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#22 14/4/09 7:12

love_Oni
Member
From: Da Nang, Vietnam
Registered: 10/5/08

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Iritscen wrote:

Hmm.  Aiko, aren't you playing on a Mac?  And has anyone else here been able to get the Fury or one of the Strikers that appear in my video to teleport like that?

I tried to do the same but it doesn't seem to work for me. (Bad luck, maybe?)


The Boy Who Knew Too Much tongue

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#23 14/4/09 9:47

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Either that, or possibly we are looking at a Mac-only quirk.  But I think it's too early to say.  All I know is that Gumby couldn't get it to happen, so that got me thinking about Mac vs. Windows.  I'll wait for more reports from people on whether they got it to happen, before I jump to any conclusions.  Just keep in mind, it takes a few tries sometimes before it happens, but I believe I've seen each of the three AIs teleport at one time or another, so throwing any of them should work, eventually.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#24 14/4/09 10:41

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

Ok, got it working on Win and Mac. But it's very hard. BTW, now I remember other teleporter. Ever played last level and found a striker behind the fence or a sniper who came down from his tower?

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#25 14/4/09 11:52

jackoverfull
Member
From: San Mauro Torinese, Italy
Registered: 12/1/09
Website

Re: Character behaviour - notice anything strange?

paradox-01 wrote:

Ok, got it working on Win and Mac. But it's very hard. BTW, now I remember other teleporter. Ever played last level and found a striker behind the fence or a sniper who came down from his tower?

Also, always in the last level, in the "climb" that you have to do to get to muro if you make someone fall in the void he sometimes returns up after some minutes and start "patrolling" the area.


"To the future, blinkin' an eye to the past!"

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