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#26 28/6/07 8:05

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

once, i used minime on a ninja, and all the time i was doing his combo over and over again on a elite who's lying down Guess what? he NEVER got up...

The ninja are special because their combo is both fast and staggering.
So if you get the timing right, you can keep hitting an enemy forever.
There's nothing the enemy can do. Here's a rather old demonstration:
http://zdlo.oni2.net/Movies/Ninjia_vs_Muro.WMV
That's obviously a major flaw of balance. It has to be fixed.

Last edited by geyser (28/6/07 8:29)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#27 28/6/07 8:20

s10k
Member
From: Portugal
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

geyser wrote:

The ninja are special because their combo is both fast and staggering.
So if you get the timing right, you can keep hitting an enemy forever.
There's nothing the enemy can do. Here's a rather old demonstration:
http://zdlo.oni2.net/Movies/Ninjia_vs_Muro.WMV
That's obviously a major flaw of balance. It has to be fixed.

Yeh that video is old. Konoko have also some of that combinations, with just punches.

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#28 28/6/07 22:07

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

oh well, the ai ninja NEVER does that though, so let's keep it that way until a MMORPG OTA really exist. even then, i still hate the part where when u're down, n u try to kick the enemy with a spring kick, BUT u're vulnerable to attacks. i mean, all the other characters don't have this weakness, only the ninja has, so it's kinda frustrating to get knocked back down when u do that n the enemy doesn't even flinch


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#29 29/6/07 4:06

s10k
Member
From: Portugal
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

One of my favorites is bomber for sure. It's nice when I die.. (of course that I use titan mode as well. tongue)

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#30 29/6/07 8:16

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

bomber eh? too bad the suicide bomb doesn't activate when we dies in OTA


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#31 29/6/07 9:55

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

the ai ninja NEVER does that though, so let's keep it that way until a MMORPG OTA really exist

I wouldn't wait for true multiplayer to do 2 things:
1) Teach the AI to use their techniques at their advantage.
2) Remove/fix all the "unfair" strengths and weaknesses.

One of my favorites is bomber for sure. It's nice when I die.. (of course that I use titan mode as well.

Wonderful. Maybe you should make a movie...
Seen this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcjbWhRFwZo  This so needs a video response. In Titan mode, of course.
The music (Yakety Sax, aka Benny Hill theme) lasts 1 minute. I would record more, and then speed up the video to match.

I'm not sure how to show the pursuers without turning around. Maybe you can try and master the dev mode camera controls smile
Enter a wide space, detach the camera, run in wild zig zags followed by the crowd and then refocus when you're really far away.

the suicide bomb doesn't activate when we dies in OTA

Actually, newer versions of OTA include an exploding bomber. It's quite fun in combination with Barabas.
However, you can't play as "the" bomber there (and if you shapeshift to a bomber, you won't explode).

Last edited by geyser (29/6/07 9:55)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#32 29/6/07 11:03

Loser
Member
From: somewhere in da Czech Republic
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

I am sorry to disagree with you, azewrath, but AI ninjas DO that combo. I have learnt about this sorta bug from one AI ninja that p_p_k_k_k_p_p_k_k_k_p_p_k_k_k_k_k me nearly to death.
tech talk P.S.:Now, when I know a bit about MELE and its mechanics, I think that ninja has very small repeat delay for this combo (of course, only some patterns, I don't know right now) which allows him by some bug to execute new technique (this combo again) while he is still doing old one.
Loser


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#33 30/6/07 5:25

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

the ai ninjas do? that's strange, i don't recall anything of them doing the whole combo repeatedly over n over again. but i do know that Mukade does the combo 2x. took out a big chunk of my life, he did tongue btw, this maybe a bit out of the topic, but have ANYONE ever snatched Mukade's gun from that master ninja himself? i'll be damned if someone did before me wink


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#34 30/6/07 15:17

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

have ANYONE ever snatched Mukade's gun from that master ninja himself? i'll be damned if someone did before me

The Devilstar used by Mukade in Chapter 10 is triggered by a special animation, so there's no gun for you to snatch from him (AFAIK).
If it's an actual Easter Egg you're talking about, tell us more about it. Maybe I missed something concerning Mukade? Well, "I'll be damned" smile


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#35 30/6/07 15:24

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

The weapon exist at least. (You can get it by munitionfrenzy..) Why let using Mukade only an animation when still the game have this weapon? hmm

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#36 30/6/07 17:13

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

Why let using Mukade only an animation when still the game have this weapon?

Because animation-bound projectiles look better that ones shot with generic pistol/rifle poses?
Murzilla's Tractor and Mukade's Devilstar are homing, and the Thunderbolt is a crowd clearer.
So it doesn't make much sense to actually "aim" those particles at you, weapon-style.

However, in DemOni, the Devilstar is a very precise 2ndary fire for the Screamer.
It flies straight along the barrel, and homes in on the target at the end if needed.
In such a situation, it makes perfect sense to shoot it from a gun. Not for bosses.


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#37 1/7/07 3:45

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

allright then, but can't someone like, comb the whole of the rooftop area for that invisible gun? tongue i realize that i may take like... YEARS n even ETERNITY yikes but geyser, we could probably know where the gun is when u modify a mod in area right? (how do i put this ~ i'm a sucker when it comes to programming) sad


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#38 1/7/07 11:32

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

After a look at CJBOWeapon.BINA, it's clear that the only gun that can be found lying around in Rooftops is the secret SBG.
Moreover, the original level logic scripts don't spawn any weapons on the ground at runtime. That leaves only carried weapons.

No character can be seen aiming w10_sni at you, but the aiming can be disabled (e.g., an AI doesn't aim when in close combat).
In that sense, yes, it's totally possible that seemingly unarmed characters (like Mukade) actually carry that nearly invisible gun.
If you knock such a character down he'll drop the weapon and you can then pick it up... if you manage to find where it fell.
However, no characters are spawned carrying w10_sni, and the original level logic doesn't give it to any character, either.

That leaves only Mukade's hardcoded combat behaviour, which just could give him w10_sni at some point so that he drops it.
AFAIK, that doesn't happen. You can make Konoko invincible, and chr_focus to Mukade, and at no moment does he have it.
In DemOni (works for the full game on the Mac), w10_sni is not as hard to spot since it appears as a big red rubber ball... smile

So...
No, AFAIK, there's no way to snatch the gun "from Mukade" or at all in the original Oni, apart from munitionfrenzy.
Developer mode and scripting (and binary hacking) make it very possible to use the Devilstar (as a weapon or not).
In the original Oni, you can shapeshift to a Ninja (not necessarily Mukade) and chr_animate 0 NINCOMfireball.
(you can bind the animation to F2 or F3, and to some dev mode hotkeys as well; you can also make it override taunts)
In DemOni, you can do that with the 3 bonus characters (Comguy Ninjas) in the Syndicate Warehouse.

In case you're interested, the dev mode has a few bugs and features that allow one to teleport around à la Mukade smile
(the corresponding animations aren't triggered, but you get total freedom of movement and tremendous warp speed)

Last edited by geyser (1/7/07 11:36)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#39 1/7/07 22:05

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

yikes ok then, but bout that teleporting issue, how do we determine where do we warp at? or rather, does it mean that we can only specify to teleport at certain area/s?


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#40 1/7/07 22:39

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

Yo, man, this is so totally off-topic. Please head over to the Modifications subforum and I'll reply smile
(short answer: chr_teleport uses preset flags, chr_location and goto take you anywhere)
(additionally, characters spawn at other preset locations, and Mukade uses 100% hardcoded locations)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#41 1/7/07 23:10

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

tongue soz dude, got a little carried away


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#42 1/7/07 23:27

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

ah well, back 2 topic : Muro's kinda Cool 2. But i don't quite like muro in the omega stage tongue, since's it's almost 2 easy 2 win using him~~! smile Mukade's bout the same as his lower ranked ninjas; i can't tell the difference of their attacks whether Mukade's more stronger or anything, but i still prefer him(cooler suit, reeaallly~ hair raising chuckle n of course, RED is my colour) big_smile


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#43 2/7/07 12:26

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

imago = omega, heh... nice pun.
The differences in fighting skills between Mukade and other Ninja have to do with the AI, not with the set of available moves (which is the same).
So as far as shapeshifting goes, they're one and the same. Another difference is that you can sprint; the original AI can't.
Note that just as there are smaller and larger Ninjas, there are smaller and larger Mukades (same goes for Barabas: random character size).
Since the smaller Mukades don't jump as high, there are places they can't jump-flip to where the larger Mukades can smile

n of course, RED is my colour

Oh really? Maybe check out the RED THREAD then smile

Last edited by geyser (2/7/07 12:28)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#44 3/7/07 6:05

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

oh ok..... but i mean, their attacks. like, fury's attack is weaker compared to an elite syndicate. what bout the comparison between bosses like mukade n his errr..... "apprentices"? is his attacks more powerful or is it just the colour difference?


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#45 28/7/07 3:22

bboyzagy
Member
Registered: 27/7/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

I myself prefer ninjas since i'm like that fast and deadly plus more agile and flexible then they but i don't jump that high...


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#46 28/7/07 9:57

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

@ bboyzagy: Your avatar and claimed ninja-style are interesting. Tell us more.
Have you seen this? http://oni.bungie.org/community/forum/v … 2191#p2191

Last edited by geyser (28/7/07 9:59)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#47 28/7/07 17:24

bboyzagy
Member
Registered: 27/7/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

No I haven't but about the ninja style I am very flexible as you can see and I can show you more pictures of me in action... but that's going of theme so like I said the ninjas are my favorite and I like Muro because of his flare float combo and the elites are good too... I like their throws especially


The B-Boy Style Will Live On

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#48 30/7/07 8:20

azewrath
Member
From: Malaysia
Registered: 21/6/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

bboyzagy wrote:

I myself prefer ninjas since i'm like that fast and deadly plus more agile and flexible then they but i don't jump that high...

Quite wrong. In fact, ninjas are probably the highest jumpers of all in the game. N they're the fastest 2 in speed of running and dashing big_smile


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#49 30/7/07 9:54

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

@ azewrath: you misunderstood bboy. What he said is this:
1) he (bboy) is just as fast and deadly as Oni's ninja.
2) he (bboy) is more agile and flexible than Oni's ninja.
3) he (bboy) can't jump as high as Oni's ninja, though.
Which starts making a point why bboy "prefers ninjas".

@ bboy: serves you right for not using punctuation smile

@ everybody: yes, ninja are the best jumpers and dashers in Oni.
Not all ninja are alike, however. Taller ninja jump slightly higher wink

Last edited by geyser (30/7/07 9:56)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#50 7/8/07 10:14

bboyzagy
Member
Registered: 27/7/07

Re: Favourite unnamed character to play as

yeah  geyser was right.... that's what I meant to say....


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