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#1 14/1/08 15:57

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Art Album / Project Konoko V

I'd like to introduce two new projects in commemoration of Oni’s Seventh Anniversary:

The Oni Art Album
and
Project Konoko V

which are found at http://s239.photobucket.com/albums/ff178/Oni7thAnnArt/.

Yes, it's a long address, deal with it tongue

The aim of the Art Album is to collect all the Oni artwork possible¹; mainly official stuff, but also fan-generated stuff².  Yes, there are other Oni galleries on the Net, but most are not actually centralized on one dependable server.  This Album is a carefully-organized collection, all on PB's server, which gives me 1GB of space.

¹Excluding artwork with minimal differences from other art, or art that is cropped but not zoomed in to show more detail; also excluding artwork I just don’t like, which is very little.

²Only if the artist submits them or approves my request to include them; I’m not going to just grab random drawings from other people’s sites.

Project Konoko V is found in the "Tracework" album and is the project that's more valuable to me personally.  You can read more about it in the album (there are read-me images).  It's not going to grow quickly, because I can only devote so much time to it each week without burning out smile  But I update it each Monday, so check back regularly.

Both projects are just getting started, but will get more complete and nifty as time goes on.  Despite the Art Album read-me, I am not looking for official art submissions yet because there are plenty of images I have not taken the time to upload yet.  Once I’ve exhausted my resources, I will ask for any images that I missed.  Fan art submissions are welcome anytime.  E-mail the album at maihasegawa7@yahoo.com.  Thanks!


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#2 14/1/08 16:23

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

O_o What a wonderful timing...

Right now it seems like we have double work. Did you saw this thread?

My recently plan was to port and expand it on the wiki. Maybe we can come to an compromise. You can work on the wiki as well, designing it with your own ideas and there linking to your Project Konoko V. Or do you prefer having an totally own site??

(The address is: http://wiki.oni2.net/Images)

Last edited by paradox-01 (14/1/08 16:27)

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#3 14/1/08 18:40

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

@ dox: Great work on the wiki. I really appreciate.


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#4 15/1/08 9:34

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

@paradox: I actually sent you a PM before announcing the Art Album but it seems you didn't notice.  The gist of the PM was that my main goal is to store everything on a single server.  Perhaps there is no need for two Oni galleries, but then again, I like having everything backed up and not dependent on other people's pages, because we've seen what happens when no one backs those images up and then the person removes the page.  The images can get lost in cyberspace.

Here's a couple ideas:
1. We could just have our separate albums; after all, that way the art is even safer than if one person has a gallery!
2. We could talk by PMs about how your gallery is organized.  There's a lot of great content but (and maybe I am too obsessive-compulsive) I would like to see it organized better, similar to how my Art Album is organized, and with more attention paid to who drew each image.  If we agreed on how to organize a single gallery, I would be perfectly content with giving up my Album and just working on Konoko V.  You already have much more Oni art than I do in my Album, after all.  But you might prefer to do things your own way, which is fine.  It's your site.  I only started mine (a couple weeks ago) because I didn't know anyone else was doing the same thing.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#5 15/1/08 11:26

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Indeed, I overlooked the massage. Maybe I should change my display style which is still the blue one...

Backing up the stuff on two different servers (plus on our personal HD) sounds to be a good idea. This way the remnant art won't go lost for sure.

Then, I think one gallery plus your Project Konoko V site should be enough. I would prefer the one wiki page as gallery because it is easily editable by contributors who want to be.

You wish more attention for the image's creator. I just don't wanted to overload the page - I'm a spartan guy. The original source (as link) was supposed to give the hint of the creator. However, about some images I know the link only and not the creator, see Wallpapers. -- No problem, we can add also the actual name (if known). That could be the structure:

/-------------------\
|/-----------------\|
||                 ||
|| thumbnail image ||
||                 ||
|\-----------------/|
|                   |
| original source   |
| made by: name     |
\-------------------/

Okay, the name-thingy is clear now. What about your better-organized structure? I see: [all] [images] [videos](?) [remix] [slideshows].
Why and what videos? Remix: I guess it's stuff like wallpapers which use original art by Lorraine. About slideshows I'm unsure again. It showing the images film-like to the visitor, he/she don't have to click, right? I think this should be available as an option (for all categories). Is that possible?

Also fan art can be remakes. Some contributors take pose and/or perspective from originals. I would like to have them just in the fan art (coloured/sketch) section so you can easily find them.

Maybe you can upload images of our choice to show how it would look like. -- For the ongoing discussion, PM or thread, it shouldn't matter.

Last edited by paradox-01 (15/1/08 12:01)

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#6 15/1/08 11:28

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

I suggest putting the source and author on every image's own page.
It's tidy and doesn't get in the way when viewing thumbs/galleries.


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#7 15/1/08 11:36

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

A bit exaggerated, IMO.
Let's see where Iritscen likes to places these infos.

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#8 15/1/08 11:43

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

"Let's see where Iritscen likes to places these infos."
OK, I command putting the info where I said smile


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#9 15/1/08 12:19

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

smile  I like your idea for giving credit, paradox, just put a single line under each thumbnail:

by ____

or, for art based on others' work (like Konoko V)

by ____
based on work by ____

And it's true that perhaps we will never know who drew each image; we can only label the ones we know.

About my own album's organization -- you are looking at the wrong part, look to the left.  See the albums?  That's how it's organized.  The point is, each type of image has its own group.  In the wiki the equivalent of what I am recommending would be:
http://wiki.oni2.net/Images/Wallpaper (which I don't have, but probably should)
http://wiki.oni2.net/Images/InGame
http://wiki.oni2.net/Images/FanArt
http://wiki.oni2.net/Images/Concept (rough sketches by Lorraine, etc.)
http://wiki.oni2.net/Images/Promotional (polished art from ads or whatever)

And maybe another page or two that I can't think of.  That's just my idea.  I dislike long sprawling wiki pages that keep getting longer.  Too many images loading, etc.

If this makes sense, I will help copy over anything from my album that you don't have yet, and then we will mirror each other as time goes on, so we all have all the same images.

Last edited by Iritscen (15/1/08 12:23)


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#10 15/1/08 12:34

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Guys: subpages, templates and categories are your friends. I'll try to help you out ASAP.
Iritscen suggests subpages, but you have to think of whether they will intersect or not...
Like, what if there's a wallpaper based on fan art. Shouldn't it go in both "categories"?

I positively insist on putting image details at least on the image's page.
You can always duplicate that info in the captions, but that's a bad idea.
The thumbnails let the user identify an image well with a casual glance.
He will then go to the image page, be it for a closer look or for details.
So in any case, the image's details should be available on that page.
That's the way it's done on Wikipedia and it makes a ton of sense smile


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#11 15/1/08 13:04

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Yeah, you have a point, the source is attributed on the image's own page.  I didn't think of it that way.  Because putting by-lines on each thumbnail will only make the page grow (not as big a deal, though, if we use subpages).

As far as wallpaper based on fan art, it goes under "Wallpaper", case closed smile  The image page (or wherever credit is given) can say that it is based on some work or another and who drew it.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#12 15/1/08 13:38

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Last point: On wiki we won't have slideshows. Will we survive this, Iritscen? If yes we could start there.

I suggest this as the new page structure. I tried orienting a bit to yours. -- What do you think?

1 The Oni Art Collection              |  1 The Oni Art Collection
  1.1 The Logo                        |      1.1 The Logo
  1.2 Wallpapers                      |      1.2 In Memory of (10 years bungie)
  1.3 Print Art                       |      1.3 Wallpapers
  1.4 Rockstar Stuff                  |      1.4 Promotional (Printed Art, Rockstar Stuff)
  1.5 In Memory of (10 years bungie)  |      1.5 Comic Book
  1.6 Win Game / Lose Game            |      1.6 In-Game (rendered Characters; Win Game & Lose Game images)
  1.7 Concept Art                     |      1.7 Concept Art (Oni 1, Oni 2 (unofficial))
  1.8 Concept Art: (unofficial) Oni 2 |      1.8 Fanart (Jokes, Digital Art, Fanart: Coloured, Fanart: Sketches, Signatures)
  1.9 Digital Art
  1.10 Signaturs
  1.11 Jokes
  1.12 Fanart: Coloured
  1.13 Fanart: Sketches

Last edited by paradox-01 (15/1/08 13:57)

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#13 15/1/08 14:06

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

The slideshow feature doesn't matter to me at all... that's just a general Photobucket thing.  I personally set up the albums, but the slideshow is just something it throws in.  I won't miss it.

On the topic of your new proposal for the page structure: I like it, but are those going to be separate pages or separate sections of one page?  I won't make a big deal out of it if you want to put it all on one page, I just wanted to give my opinion on subpages.  I would be glad to help in contributing to the gallery in either case.

By the way, I wanted to say that I appreciate that you are now featuring the images hosted on the wiki, not the external ones which can get broken.  That was a concern of mine that is now fixed.

Last edited by Iritscen (15/1/08 14:19)


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#14 15/1/08 14:28

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Just to clarify:
Right now, the main page is http://wiki.oni2.net/Images
Every image will have it's own page. geyser gave an example with http://wiki.oni2.net/Image:The_oni_logo.gif
On such a page will written the original source and the image creator's name.

> I won't make a big deal out of it if you want to put it all on one page

Hm, like I said I tried to get a simliar structure to your site. But it seems that you focus actually on this:

> I just wanted to give my opinion on subpages

This would be also on http://wiki.oni2.net/Image:whatever.xyz

No need for other subpages like: http://wiki.oni2.net/Images/Fanart right?

I hope I got it this time.

Last edited by paradox-01 (26/1/08 8:27)

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#15 15/1/08 14:54

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Sure, that's fine.  Let's go with your proposal above for the contents (1.1-1.8).  I am out of time today but I will help out tomorrow (if you need any help, and maybe you don't :-)

By the way, what anime is your avatar from?


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#16 15/1/08 15:50

paradox-01
Member
From: Germany
Registered: 14/1/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

I won't have much freetime in the rest of this week so feel free to work on it.
Edit: The wiki have already the comic on it but the pictures are not from the digital version. Maybe you can upload yours. Ask Alloc if he can delete then the old images. (http://wiki.oni2.net/Comics0 up to Comics3)

ps: my avatar is from "fate stay night". I chose it because he really looks a bit like me. ^^

pps: you wonder about this ? Have a look here again.  smile
By the way, good work this one. And the matrix style is amusing. "Come on." She is almost smiling. xD

Last edited by paradox-01 (15/1/08 16:01)

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#17 15/1/08 16:17

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

paradox-01 wrote:

I won't have much freetime in the rest of this week so feel free to work on it.  The wiki have already the comic on it but the pictures are not from the digital version. Maybe you can upload yours. Ask Alloc if he can delete then the old images. (http://wiki.oni2.net/Comics0 up to Comics3)

Will do.

Have a look here again.

Well, I guess that helps... I wish I knew what it was, though.  I guess it could be anything; a pack for carrying hypos, a gun...?

And the matrix style is amusing. "Come on." She is almost smiling. xD

Yeah, I just love that art.  That severe perspective effect is very rare in Lorraine's work.  I want to add a lot of detail to it to really bring it to life.  About the smile, I did add just a bit of curve to that mouth.  Lorraine's version of the mouth is flat, but I wanted just a tad of a smirk there, like she's challenging someone.  It's much more martial-arts-looking than most of her poses in-game or out-of-game, which is which I mention karate in the title.


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#18 20/1/08 23:34

VidBoi7
Member
Registered: 21/12/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

New work by Rina on her DA

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#19 21/1/08 0:28

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Yeah, she released a few sketches. The chibi is OK, but as for the rest, there's room for improvement.
There's another Russian artist who could contribute some concept art and stuff, check him out here:
http://onimia.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=2566#p2566


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#20 21/1/08 2:02

VidBoi7
Member
Registered: 21/12/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Damn. Russians get all the talent.

As for Rina, its probly better than my stuff. The expressions have some 'meh', but then again -- who can compare to Guido?

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#21 21/1/08 7:02

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Heh, no one's perfect. Guido often disregards anatomy and such in his sketches.
That other Russian guy has some really nice sense of realism and detail. Like me.
Rina is in the process of making her own character drawing style. Explains a lot.
It's hard to tell what would make Rina's faces "work". Feel free to tell us/her...
The way I did that with Guido's drawings was just edit his sketches into shape.
Then I'd show the "corrected" versions to him, pointing out alternatives etc.


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#22 21/1/08 7:44

guido
Member
From: Milan, Italy
Registered: 25/4/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

after seeing this one I couldn't help posting something here. There it seems to be a few points I must voice out for sake's sake.
My own opinion is, Rina is a sure bet to manage a major revamp of the art of Oni. She is young but she has shown up a rare quality to me: however her style might be improved, Rina's characters look truly alive. Her drawings imply a positive energy my moody pictures can't. And this is what really counts for me. Give her some time and she will surprise you all. With or without geyser's guidance. She needs to be encouraged and to experiment, not to change her style.
As for the other (russian) candidate, aside all mannerisms, I can't tell I am impressed. He's got fine techniques, I can give him  that.  You may use him for mecha and chara design and such, but nothing more.

@Geyser, sorry dude, but there are two things we are not on the same page. First off, sketches are called sketches for a clear reason. They must convey a feeling and an overall impression, they do not aim at  completeness, and they work as a useful tool for teamwork. They are just a taste and an excuse to trigger new ideas in a creative process. Secondly, the only times we had this back-and-forth exchanges were on a couple brainstorming sessions (for few mai's faces with seventeenseconds, and that unreleased endlevel splashcreen thing). Don't feel yourself entitled to edit everybody's work, Geyser-  or the only one who can do that. Also you must understand one thing: it's been my working method, it works with me, not necessarily with everyone. All the creative partnerships I am currently in are managed this way, because I want people to put their hands on my stuff.
A limit applies too. When I resolve to finalize a drawing, I assure you, sharing my own ideas in the process is the last thing I seek.


Keep up the good work.

Last edited by guido (21/1/08 8:06)


What if this is as good as it gets?

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#23 21/1/08 9:08

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

"She needs to be encouraged and to experiment, not to change her style."
She hasn't found her style yet and she knows it, so she's open to critique.
However, she hasn't had the time to experiment much with Oni so far...
Like you, I think she can come to rock our world over the next 7 months.
But you know how things are when it comes to actual "production" of art.

"They must convey a feeling and an overall impression, they do not aim at completeness"
Well, yeah, but overall consistence doesn't hurt, and a sketch doesn't have to have flaws.
Some artists just can't seem to draw a messy face no matter how rushed the sketch is.
Then again, maybe they rely less on intuition and more on construction lines and such.

"As for the other (russian) candidate, aside all mannerisms, I can't tell I am impressed."
You have seen 3 pieces of rather somber-themed concept art. Don't jump to conclusions.
I've asked him to have a try at Oni's characters after a look at the artwork for Strident.

"You may use him for mecha and chara design and such, but nothing more."
That's exactly what he advertised himself as, and what I advertised him as.
I'm pretty sure he can do lively characters, but concept art is his trick, sure.

"Secondly, the only times we had this back-and-forth exchanges were on a couple brainstorming sessions"
As it happens, we've exchanged drafts with Rina when it came to designing a new main menu background.

"Don't feel yourself entitled to edit everybody's work, Geyser - or the only one who can do that."
I wasn't singling myself out, dude. I was merely encouraging others to take chances with that.
VidBoi7 said Rina's expressions "had some 'meh' " - I wanted something constructive out of it.

Last edited by geyser (21/1/08 9:41)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#24 30/1/08 10:32

geyser
Member
From: beyond the veil
Registered: 14/1/07
Website

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

Late comment on "Karate Konoko".
With the hand gesture and the "smirk" added by Iritscen, it really reminds me of this: http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=KKTDRqQtPO8
"Hold your hands like you're crippled, a goofy smirk... as long as you commit, it will always work" Muahaha, just kidding smile

Last edited by geyser (30/1/08 10:36)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#25 30/1/08 10:43

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Art Album / Project Konoko V

That *is* funny.  I have high hopes for Karate Konoko, by the way (I was going to title it "Karateka Konoko" to show how down I am with the martial arts (not very), but it just sounds wrong when you say it).  I really want to put a buttload of detail and shading into it.  Maybe 1.5 buttloads.

Edit: OK, I'm dumb: what is the link to Rina's art on DA?  I can't find it.

Last edited by Iritscen (30/1/08 10:48)


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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