Oni remake

SomeGuy · 09/07/17 04:09

Gumby wrote:

semicloud wrote:
multiplayer in ONi would be interesting to do. i saw a thread on this here.
Yes, it's been done before, by me. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GMeWr11QVjU
As for all the rest...whatever you say. Was just trying to be helpful. Especially with the engine choice. If you want help you will have to work with people. Using Blender will make that hard. Refusing to listen to advice and feedback will also make that hard.

A bit unrelated but was wondering for a while, do you ever plan to comeback to the project to improve it? It was really cool, tested it out myself and worked pretty damn good for a mod, also considering it's for game that doesn't even support mods officially.

Last edited by SomeGuy (09/07/17 04:09)

semicloud · 09/07/17 09:09

also, wat does everyone think about the current state of ONI. a game that's 10+ years old with no updates or sequel. is everyone content with that scenario or wat. that's wat i am asking. wat would plp like to see happen. does everyone still play ONi.

Last edited by semicloud (09/07/17 13:09)

EdT · 09/07/17 16:09

@semicloud: You have a lot of interesting and fun concepts, one day I hope we can see it in a demo, then a game.

semicloud · 09/07/17 19:09

like scorpio at LA aiport ONi. i bet u wanna see that

so every character in ONI has a special move. THe the original programmer at bungie classified Shift, release shift, Kick or Punch for specials

barabus has one, but it's too over powered for a special move

subzero has the same special move on a punch combination that fire a freeze ball. it may or may not be affected by gravity, also it may or not have the ability to home. so you have to arc it like a grenade launcher to get range on it.

wat this move does is it freezes the opponent for a duration until they thaw out but it also does insane amount of damage to them if you get hit. it can't be blocked and it has a freeze radius

this move would be too powerful if you were to spam it. so i created a new theoretical classification for this move. it's classified as a special move but it's also classified as range weapon. in fact, if you look at subzero's hand, you will see a tech piece that makes it possible. it's a weapon because it behave like a weapon in almost ways. it accept blue energy ammo and has an ammo capacity like a weapon. in fact, it uses the weapon indicator on left corner. nothing is changed. you will still see ammo capacity for this special. only difference is there will be symbol for special move that replaces the type of weapon it is. this is already regular on ONI. it's complicated integrated as a weapon

on default, one reload, yes this weapon has a reload animation. subzero can't carry guns. so when you press R it reloads his default weapon which is his special

this also plans to do a ice-clone move which is his kick combination. nothing changes. it still exhaust his special ammo like his freeze ball. the ice-clone move will cause him to create a clone of himself but back flipping out the way. anyone run into it will be frozen.

there is a tech piece that may or may not be in the game. it's wat's called ammo converter box. it converts any type of ammo into another. so if u had ballistic, u could theoretically convert to green or vice versa. you carry this in your inventory system on a F1 Menu.

Last edited by semicloud (09/07/17 20:09)

semicloud · 09/07/17 22:09

there is a new post about ONI multiplayer that renewed my interest in discussing it. i will reply here on my thread so i can glean it. hacking a game is difficult. a lot of work is figuring how to reverse engineering everything. this is why i don't like modding. there is another approach, recreation of the game with meticulous detail so it will and play like ONI almost identically. this is actually really interest because the whole idea is to convince the original ONI player that this remake is almost indistinguish from the original. this require a meticulous attention detail in recreating the feel of something.

multiplayer is dry cut in blender once a combat frame work as been established. all that's left is actually to relay combat data. this is much easier than hacking because python already provides function to do this. since there is overall transparency when it comes to this time of project, no hacking is required. literally anybody could take the source project and add multiplayer functionality.

the post kinda have me interested in creating a multiplayer framework. in a creative development process like this. interest is everything. i'm considering making multiplayer functionality the first focus. the idea is to establish a server and have a internal login system when player boot up. no IP addresses are required. this will be equivalent to booting into a DOA server, only login information is required.

i will ask this question. wat does the community consider to be priority. a remake of campaign mode with all the features i mentioned or a multiplayer mode.

Last edited by semicloud (09/07/17 22:09)

Gumby · 09/08/17 00:09

"multiplayer is dry cut in blender once a combat frame work as been established. all that's left is actually to relay combat data. this is much easier than hacking because python already provides function to do this. since there is overall transparency when it comes to this time of project, no hacking is required. literally anybody could take the source project and add multiplayer functionality."

Hahaha, no. You have a lot to learn if you think anything multiplayer is easy.

semicloud · 09/08/17 01:09

i'm saying assuming i had the core functionality of combat built, it would be easier to add multiplayer from there than hacking ONI to do it.

Last edited by semicloud (09/08/17 01:09)

semicloud · 09/08/17 14:09

edt, can u give me step by step instruction on how to extract texture from any level including characters and objects. if AE is required, instruction to install, and instructions after install. i'm really not the modding mindset rite now to figure it out.

also, is there a way to extract the character models from ONI into a format blender can recognize. currently, blender imports these formats:

Last edited by semicloud (09/08/17 14:09)

EdT · 09/08/17 15:09

1) Download Vago GUI http://mods.oni2.net/node/247 Here is the support thread: http://oni.bungie.org/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2385

2) Go to the Levels Tab in Vago, "From" dropdown menu should be "DAT" and "To" dropdown menu "ONI FILES"

3) Click the "Add" button and go to the GameDataFolder directory. Select the levelx_Final.dat you are interested in, then Click the "Convert" button

4) At the top of Vago there is a folder icon, that will contain the files you have extracted. In the Levels directory, there will be DAT - ONI FILES directory, inside is the level you selected. That has all the .oni files. TXMP-textures. TRBS-Character models. AKEV-Environment and so on.

5) To get Textures use the Texture tab in Vago, Characters in the Characters tab, TRBS will give you the model in dae, ONCC will give you dae plus textures.

6 To get the Level environment, use the Levels tab, "From" AKEV ONI "to" DAE.

That should get you started.

EDIT: Specific questions about using Vago should be asked in the support thread.

semicloud · 09/08/17 16:09

thanks, i appreciate that

Last edited by semicloud (09/09/17 03:09)

semicloud · 09/09/17 03:09

rants: you probably want to ignore this post because this would technically be classified as theory. I make no claim to you that this represents exciting progress though i think this is very exciting.

game design is not just about a physical product. it's also examines theories about human motivation, wat drives a person to builds a game. if the drive is not there, game design becomes pure work. this is the aspect of game design i am trying to identify. i believe these thought experiments are essential for progress to be made because it examine why we do wat we do. i constantly examines these things.

the first 3d game i ever built was with the core design release of the 3d level editor after core design decided to abandon the franchise after chronicles, and decided to let fans continue the legacy of the game. why these significant was this system was actually used by the original team to build levels. it was hard to imagine a separate tool was created for fan's amusement.

wat's significant about this tool was it was insanely fun to use. it wasn't fun to use not because it provided physics. actually, you couldn't technically see the physics of the game until run time. wat's powerful about this tool is it psychologically hyped you up for the prospect that wat you designed could immediately be interpreted as gameplay.

look at the left picture. could you tell if i have physics or not. you can't. i could have physics completely built. you just made an interpretation that i don't have physics simply because i didn't show it. look at the picture to the right, this may not have physics at all cause you can't make a direct interpretation. wat's visually presented is only a interpretation.

the point here is the TRLE was fun because you were physically determining the layout of the level by each design choice you made.

wat's fun about game design is technically everything. but everything can't be taken at once. you have to limit yourself to a specific aspect of game design that interest you and progress from that point. wat makes blender so powerful is not the fact it's a game engine. wat makes it so powerful is it's immediately ability to mock up a 3d environment.

it's very interesting how the TRLE editor works by examining it through the human psychology of motivation. notice the exact placement of Lara could be determined by placing her on a square. the interface allow you to visually texture each square but also set up enemy triggers. it's hard to imagine that core design actually would use this editor because this was actually fun. game design isn't suppose to be fun rite.

in fact, blender was a much powerful editor than TRLE cause you had completely liberity on level design. you could cut faces out walls. you could import assets as TRLE editor allows, but a key difference is you can model your own assets.

Last edited by semicloud (09/09/17 04:09)

semicloud · 09/09/17 12:09

blender is being garbage. it's missing basic features to work. don't know if i will have time to write a engine and modeler. this would be a long term project if i have to write the engine like pierre did. be really fun to do though. a custom engine just for this project would be interesting.

things to note about this engine if i were to write it:
-sourced in Java
-lightweight, minimal foot print
-GPU independent, does not use GPU acceleration. everything is done in processor. this raises compatibility.
-has a built in modeler
-built in animation system
-open sourced/extensible, anyone could extend the frame work

everything u will ever need to do is done in one software just like blender except this one will actually work

additional details about the project, which will seriously commence if i can't get simple shading to work in blender

Built in Modeler
-key features as mesh cut, edge/vertex erase and creation, N-gon support.
-mirroring of course

Animation system
-bone support/key frames

Scripting
-scripting will be done in native Java.

Game Engine
-texture/lighting : this is technically done in modeling view. uv maps, ambient lighting, and procedural color
-basic physics: add velocity, gravity
-API for user to access object data and geometry data as well as functions to manipulate it.
-collision handling
-AI path finding

coding a engine is really last resort.

Last edited by semicloud (09/09/17 13:09)

Gumby · 09/10/17 08:09

blender is being garbage. it's missing basic features to work. don't know if i will have time to write a engine and modeler. this would be a long term project if i have to write the engine like pierre did. be really fun to do though. a custom engine just for this project would be interesting.

This is why you don't use Blender as an engine.

things to note about this engine if i were to write it:
-sourced in Java

"Interesting" choice. Be careful about garbage collection.

-lightweight, minimal foot print

This directly conflicts with working in Java. Use C++ if you don't want bloat.

-GPU independent, does not use GPU acceleration. everything is done in processor. this raises compatibility.

Do not do this. If you want compatibility, write it in OpenGL with a minimal subset of features. Otherwise, your game won't run at any appreciable framerate, and you won't get to actually use any advantages of modern hardware. Trust me, as someone who has worked on multiple production engines, this is not the way to go about this.

coding a engine is really last resort.

Then why make one? Please, just use Unity. Have you ever tried it? 99% of the game industry separates their model creation tools and their level creation tools. There are very good reasons for this. You aren't saving yourself any time or pain.

I mean, or ignore me. The best way to learn is to make your own mistakes, I guess. Just trying to save your time.

semicloud · 09/10/17 10:09

my computer is too old for unity. my laptop is like 10 years old probably. i may download it again to see. if it starts lagging on the basic interface i'm uninstalling it.

Last edited by semicloud (09/10/17 10:09)

Gumby · 09/10/17 10:09

Ahh, that's unfortunate. You're going to have issues running most things, then. Laptops do not make great development machines, my condolences.

semicloud · 09/10/17 10:09

my laptop runs ONI

Gumby · 09/10/17 10:09

Yes...I get that. Your 2007 laptop can run a 2001 game.

semicloud · 09/10/17 10:09

i probably have a super computer compard to wat bungie used to dev the game

Last edited by semicloud (09/10/17 10:09)

Gumby · 09/10/17 10:09

Which is also 2001 tech (being run on a high end 2001 machine). What approximate year of game development technology are you aiming for here?

Last edited by Gumby (09/10/17 10:09)

semicloud · 09/10/17 10:09

2001 oni

Gumby · 09/10/17 11:09

Aha! Now I get the issue here. Okay. For that approach...yeah, you might have to write your own. Or use an older engine. Quake3 or OGRE, maybe. There are some free engines out there that are better than Blender.

semicloud · 09/10/17 11:09

blender doesn't work. there is a difference between something being better and not working. it would be like saying a car driving on the high way is better than a broken down car on the highway. i'm not looking for better, just something that works for the goal of the project.

Last edited by semicloud (09/10/17 11:09)

Gumby · 09/10/17 11:09

By "better" I mean "should work".

semicloud · 09/10/17 11:09

as for the open gl comment, i don't think i need GPU acceleration for a game tech that's 2001. wat u think.

Last edited by semicloud (09/10/17 11:09)

Gumby · 09/10/17 11:09

You really don't have a choice, you have to communicate with the GPU somehow. Your laptop has a GPU, it's just not a very good one. You will have to experiment with what runs best on your system.

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