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#51 13/2/12 17:39

Mukade
Member
From: Ottawa, Ontario - Canada
Registered: 29/5/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

I mean, obviously it would still be bugged, if you went in for a surprise, close ranged gun attack, but it would work a bit better


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#52 3/4/13 2:32

Samer
Member
From: Lebanon
Registered: 4/9/09
Website

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

now available 2 variations of this mod:
Brutal Konoko : Redesign of Konoko's melee profile only to be more brutal. It doesn't affect the melee profiles of other characters.
Brutal AI : Redesign of all relevant melee profiles including Konoko's. This modification creates extra challenge by allowing A.I. characters to fully utilize their close combat potential.

they can be downloaded from within the new installer.

Last edited by Samer (3/4/13 2:32)


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#53 4/5/13 8:21

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

I've now made a package out of Loser's revamp of Barabas that was posted on page 2.  I know he won't approve of this being released because "it's just an experiment", but I find it works well.  The frequency of Earthquaker has been turned way down from Brutal AI's levels, and he fights smarter, using trickier, faster moves and dodging more with the aid of his jetpack.  Thus I've named the package Smart Barabas.  It installs after Brutal AI so that by installing both, you can get the improvements to other AIs and also overwrite the annoying Barabas with the smarter one smile  You can find the mod listed in the AE Installer.

I've also made a separate particle mod out of the Jumpable Earthquaker, so look for it under that name in the Installer.  Now the Earthquaker can be dodged completely even at close range, but it requires good timing; otherwise, you take massive damage.  I've found the cartwheel escape to be a good way to take less damage by getting away quickly, when a jump isn't possible.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#54 4/5/13 8:49

Samer
Member
From: Lebanon
Registered: 4/9/09
Website

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

the best and latest Barabas version by Loser is in EdT's boss level mod .. is this the same one ?
I've always wanted that as a separate package as well tongue http://oni.bungie.org/community/forum/v … 206#p45206


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#55 4/5/13 9:13

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Oh!  I've compared the melee profile and Barabas' particles, and they are indeed the same Barabas.  I'll note that in the Smart Barabas description.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#56 5/5/13 3:09

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Guys i just tested the mod out, Barabas uses more moves, other moves when the mod is not installed(Brutal AI), otherwise completely non-existent after the Smart Barabas is installed but he does use his jet pack a lot more for dodging. The spam still seems consistent in my opinion, getting hit twice is enough to kill Konoko from the overpowered mode. I'm telling you this as I'm stuck, around 20 attempts at Barabas already. I need to know if anybody else has actually finished the level, or else I deem it impossible for now :\


What does it matter? Even if the odds are against me, I'll do it, it doesn't matter.

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#57 5/5/13 4:33

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Yeah the smart Barabas is harder cause, he does earth shaker with the gun, which makes me unable to take advantage of him using the gun. :\ he counters my attack with earth shaker. i have posted it on the forum, and i have finished it now, without the smart Barabas mod.I find both consistently using earth shakers, only the smart one uses it while I'm attacking him more often than not

Last edited by tens (5/5/13 7:40)


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#58 5/5/13 8:15

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Well, I didn't test this mod thoroughly, but my impression was that Smart Barabas used Earthquaker less than Brutal Barabas and even regular Barabas.  When I compared his melee profiles, I believe the weight on Earthquaker was turned way down, which seemed to confirm what I was seeing.  I know that Loser felt that the WMC was dumbing down Barabas and wanted to prevent the gun from being a handicap, so that must be why he allows Earthquakers while Barabas is armed.

Personally I didn't find it too hard to beat Smart Barabas, as I changed my tactics completely from how I normally fight him and found a new method that works better (probably took three tries while I learned how to deal with his new moves).  You definitely have to take advantage of the hypos in the area, I'll say that.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#59 6/5/13 11:53

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Yeah i have been testing for the past few hours...Smart barabas actually uses Earthshaker a lot more.. He uses it as a defensive / counter for my attack... the regular Brutal barabas is actually easier to beat, cause he uses it randomly and u may not be in a move while he does it. And also Smart barabas runs a lot using the jet packs, and the trail does damage. But Brutal Barabas is waay easier to beat than the Smart one. :\, i could barely attack against smart barabas, he comboes i block, he earthshaker i jump, he interrupts my combo with a grab to my skull... and pretty much blocks all my kicks and i'm left with the gun usage bug, but he earthshakers when i run towards him...


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#60 6/5/13 12:48

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Have you tried using guns instead of melee? wink


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#61 6/5/13 13:17

Samer
Member
From: Lebanon
Registered: 4/9/09
Website

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

I have a suggestion ... Barabas in level 3 should use the toned down barabas melee .. Meaning not brutal nor smart ...
while barabas in tctf final save should use smart or brutal AI... So it makes sense that he's stronger \ upgraded himself second time you face him.
i can do that by restoring the vanilla melee profile for the barabas in level 3 in the brutal AI pack .. But keeping the changes for the tctf level one (they use different melee ids) ... Tens can you test the TCTF Barabas ? I think you'll find him less spamy than that of level 3.
Does smart barabas modify both melee profiles that of barabas level 3 and of the tctf one ? If not i suspect you may be still getting the spammy brutal ai for level 3 barab but with some moves\trams of the smart barabas when they're installed together.

Last edited by Samer (6/5/13 13:26)


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#62 6/5/13 16:18

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Actually, comparing the Profiles in Brutal AI and Smart Barabas, I see now that there is no difference in Ch. 3 Barabas (BARABAS Rsrch D).  Only BARABAS TCTF D has been changed in the Smart version.  For whatever reason, I thought I saw a difference in his fighting style between the two mods in Ch. 3, but perhaps that was because the AI's behavior can vary so much due to randomization that in some fights, they'll hardly use a move at all, and the next time they'll spam it.

Anyway, I frankly have no more time to spend on this, not even to look at the files, so if someone else wants to tweak it, feel free.  It's not my mod anyway, I just uploaded it ^_^


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#63 6/5/13 19:06

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Well wonder if it's the placebo effect, if the thing hasn't actually been changed, but the Barabas does use his jet packs, and combos in the smarter version more often


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#64 6/5/13 21:37

Samer
Member
From: Lebanon
Registered: 4/9/09
Website

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

That's what i suspected .. When both mods are installed together .. Chapter 3 barabas is still getting the brutal AI melee profile, but because the smart barabas changes also some trams which apply to both chapter 3 and tctf he uses those moves with the brutal ai melee profile making it much harder than that of tctf barabas.
i'll fix it once i get the time.


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#65 6/5/13 21:49

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Awesome...but actually speaking, i beat him, and have proper footage xD il put out the video after a few hours. I'm having problems with my computer right now...


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#66 7/5/13 4:57

Samer
Member
From: Lebanon
Registered: 4/9/09
Website

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

It's not that hard tongue
take a look http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASyyzfIc … e=youtu.be using Smart Barabas .. no hypo usage and limited weapon usage, playing on hard. The trick is to keep attacking. P.S: whatever items I had were from my vanilla save (no item cheats).

Last edited by Samer (7/5/13 4:59)


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#67 7/5/13 6:28

uroboros
Member
From: Poland
Registered: 14/10/11

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Oh yes new Barabas ai is really great. But does his health regeneration particles still damage the player? This move was seriously too powerful, especially when I was fighting him at the end of TCTFHQ without any hypos.

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#68 7/5/13 6:39

Samer
Member
From: Lebanon
Registered: 4/9/09
Website

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

They only damage you if you have barabas damaging regeneration installed, that's a different mod.


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#69 7/5/13 8:04

uroboros
Member
From: Poland
Registered: 14/10/11

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

I like that.

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#70 7/5/13 9:32

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Dude i didn't cheat as well.. it is that Brutal AI is also installed, i didn't install the brutal Konoko. Plus i installed Jumpable Earthshaker, Not sure if it increases earth shaker's damage but it is there, and for some reason at far range, earth shaker will still hit you, even if u jump, and u still take the same amount of damage at the very edge of it like if you were only a few steps away. And Yeah I can beat him easily now. I was able to beat before 2, but i lost many times cause he counters my running lariat or kick throw with earthshaker right before i got to him, I don't know why he wasn't spamming it for you, and i take like 3/4 damage when i get hit with earth shaker from close proximity, i die from 2. Unless i take one in Doadan mode. I'll upload the blooper real from Barabas in a while...He really pissed me off xD


What does it matter? Even if the odds are against me, I'll do it, it doesn't matter.

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#71 7/5/13 9:50

Iritscen
Moderator
From: NC, USA
Registered: 22/10/07

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

Oh, you didn't say you'd installed Jumpable Earthquaker (notice the "qu" wink). I warned that it was much more damaging in my post above when I uploaded the mod.  Remember, Oni has guns for a reason; it's not a martial-arts simulator, so you aren't cheating if you use them.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#72 7/5/13 10:26

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

no no.. i did use the guns..i got tired of making him pick up his gun and then me lariating him every time.. xD


What does it matter? Even if the odds are against me, I'll do it, it doesn't matter.

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#73 7/5/13 10:28

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

The problem was, when i was doing this, against smart barabas. (now im sure that he does do more earth quakers) in it. since against (Only brutal ai) barabas doesn't use earthshaker when im running upto him for the running lariat. Meanwhile in Smart barabas (NOT 100%) he does use his earth quaker with the gun... when i run towards him.


What does it matter? Even if the odds are against me, I'll do it, it doesn't matter.

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#74 7/5/13 10:31

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

@Irit and Samer, there is a bug in the jumpable earth shaker mod. Unless u reach full height in any of your jumps.. you won't dodge it.. is that on purpose ? cause i have been off the ground (yes a jump not a running kick or something like that) and still have been getting hit. i have gotten hit in the furthest range possible while in max height also.


What does it matter? Even if the odds are against me, I'll do it, it doesn't matter.

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#75 7/5/13 10:35

tens
Member
From: Dota 2
Registered: 27/4/13

Re: Complete redesign of melee profiles

@Samer what recording software do u use... i use fraps and it limits the fps to 30, which is fuckin terrible and also causes some hyper camera movement. that by itself actually makes the game twice as hard xD... i cant turn around towards the direction i want to lariat or kick throw..help! smile thanks


What does it matter? Even if the odds are against me, I'll do it, it doesn't matter.

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