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#26 5/7/11 8:14

TOCS
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

The hair is designed a bit awkward. It makes the texture work hard. I don't really know what you can do about it, to be honest. Oni is quite limited. >_>


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#27 5/7/11 13:58

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Guys is it the number of points or the number of triangles that counts ?

the konoko HD head has  943 pts & 1572 triangles

Iritscen said before that : Each of the 19 parts can have up to 2048 vertices, but we ask that you pretend the limit is 1024 vertices to allow room for a cel shading option. http://oni.bungie.org/community/forum/v … d=1160&p=1

Last edited by Samer (5/7/11 22:44)


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#28 5/7/11 14:46

EdT
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Samer: I posted the link to the comgirl before http://edt.oni2.net/AE_Files/Comgirl.zip  Yes I was able to import into Oni.  The problem was the hair, Lapis used single planes for the hair, so one side has the texture, the other is black.  Also, he designed the head to use transparent textures, which don't work in character models.

Anyways, play around with the model files.

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#29 5/7/11 16:33

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

soo ... i decreased the vertices to 800 instead of 969  imported the head successfully

and here
oni%2525202011-07-05%25252022-57-22-439_cr.jpgoni%2525202011-07-05%25252022-57-25-821_cr.jpg

my problem was when using the original lapis head was this :
oni%2525202011-07-05%25252022-27-53-544.jpg
those green triangle things would flutter all over the screen and if she gets to close the face texture would cover the entire screen.

however we're not done yet the back of the head looks like this :
oni%2525202011-07-05%25252022-57-41-110.jpg


eventhough in xsi it looks like this :
SNAG-0125.jpg


i'm not sure how i'm going to fix that but i'll try my best. if i can't fix it can u live with it or should we stick to the less complex head ?


also EdT how did u remove those eyelashes things before :\ ?? every time i try a chunk of the eye goes too tongue did u select the edges individually ? .. it's easier if one could select the U.V maps of the eyelashes and make xsi somehow select the corresponding edges on the 3d model .. but i can't seem to find a way to do that :\

Last edited by Samer (5/7/11 16:38)


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#30 5/7/11 17:03

Lukas Kreator
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Let me see... If you can't really, really fix that, then I'd stick with the less complex head, because, at least, that seems like hair. However, if you can fix that it would look wonderful, as it already looks by the front.

By what I understood, these parts of the hair just don't have a "back", so I'd maybe suggest making copies of some of that parts and rotating then to the other side, so it would look like one part with two sides, but I don't really know how that works.

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#31 5/7/11 17:27

Lithium
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

She looks much better big_smile

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#32 5/7/11 18:14

Iritscen
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Lapis wrote:

Hopefully I can sort out transparency or [there] wouldn't be much point in me making the hair the way I did.

If you want to use the original head, the hair definitely needs to be fixed (unless we can hack in support for character texture transparency; I don't understand the technical issue there).  I suspect it's a fair amount of work to make that hair look decent in Oni.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#33 5/7/11 18:22

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

if i know how he made them transparent i can undo it :\ but i don't get how he made that

so if any of u could tell me how in xsi one can make model transparent ?  i could do the opposite .. is it something in the settings ? is it cz he made the polygons thin ? how :\

Last edited by Samer (5/7/11 19:32)


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#34 5/7/11 19:59

EdT
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Samer: you make the polygon transparent by the use of the alpha channel in the texture. Think of the glass in Oni, that uses a transparent texture.
However that does not work with 3D models you get weird effects, like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAFtdKC32es  The issue is how Oni handles back face culling.  So by removing the alpha channel from the head texture, you get rid of the transparency.

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#35 5/7/11 20:08

Iritscen
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing, Samer.  I was referring to how the hair looks like strips of paper.  I believe that Lapis' intention was for the square ends to look like they were coming to a point by using transparency in the texture map (that is, the alpha channel).


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#36 5/7/11 20:09

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

i removed the alpha channel yet still the back of the head doesn't show those polygons lie they're shown i xsi ... is there any other possibility ? could it because the polygon is to thin ?


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#37 5/7/11 20:10

Iritscen
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Polygons have thickness? :-\


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#38 5/7/11 20:16

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

i don't know sad this is what i'm talking about :

on xsi the hair shows form the back .. in game they don't show from the back though they show from the front look :
2011-07-06_041233.jpg

what is causing this ?

i'm ok with the square end thing ... i just don't want her to look bald from the back.

Last edited by Samer (5/7/11 20:17)


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#39 5/7/11 20:47

Iritscen
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Okay, this is a separate issue from the transparency.  Lapis also didn't understand that Oni needs two-sided objects.  You need to duplicate those strands of hair and flip them so there's something to see from the back.  By "flip", I mean not just translating the polygons across an axis, but the normals too.  The issue is that normals can only point one way, and the current strands point forward, so the polys only get rendered from the front.

To see what I mean, load a level in a multi-story building like Ch. 3, turn on p3_everythingbreakable, and shoot the floor on the second story.  You will probably see the floor below through the hole.  Fall through the floor, and look up, and you'll see an intact ceiling.  Floors and ceiling are separate planes (sets of polys) with normals pointing in opposite directions (and with separate textures too, but that's not important).


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#40 5/7/11 20:53

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

u mean like this ^_^ ?
2011-07-06_045021.jpg


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#41 5/7/11 21:47

Iritscen
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Ah, there you go!  But I still have to say, that square hair just does not do it for me.


byproducts are fine, but where's the beef?

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#42 5/7/11 22:41

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

sad I really wish i could please everyone's taste .. but i can't this is the max that i can do with her ...
i'm really proud of how she turned out .. i managed to decrease the lapis head from 4103 points to 1288 points without any significant detail loss smile
and i managed to do the "invert polygon thing", and texture her and make the body in proportion and stay true to litria's sketch ... she's not perfect .. but comparing it to any other original existing character or custom made character she's .. better. the hair is not polygony like before, there are nice details the face is smooth and no buffer overflow ... so yeah big_smile don't compare it to HD konoko I'm not a pro. (i don't mean u alone Iritscen)
if it's easy to decrease the square thingies i would have done it cz i do agree, but for me it's not easy the head mesh is very complex and i'm getting tired with the head :\ i want to continue the body.

anyway guys i got to ask do u like her more as a brunette ? darker hair hides the squares more and appears to give it more volume. i personally still prefer the blonde

2011-07-06_062935.jpg

or oni%2525202011-07-06%25252007-04-53-153_cr.jpg compromise between totally blond and brown hair

or maybe tongue tongue oni%2525202011-07-06%25252006-52-03-665_cr.jpg ? nah just kidding

Last edited by Samer (5/7/11 23:09)


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#43 5/7/11 23:16

EdT
Moderator

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Samer, you are doing great.  You can't please everyone, so get to a point where you are happy with it.  It someone doesn't like it, then let them modify it themselves :-)

Regarding the square hair, perhaps you can edit the polygon in point mode.  Then you can move the corner points so that the hair end does not look so square.

Anyways, take a break from the hair, work on the body, then go back to the hair.

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#44 5/7/11 23:22

Phydur
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

.... i like the green hair....


I intentionally spell dang, dange, FYI.

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#45 5/7/11 23:25

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

hehe ok EdT tongue but i'm having a hard time selecting the hair color now :\ what color do u think is best Edt ?

yet another option tongue Oni%2525202011-07-06%25252007-37-55-42_cr.jpg I'd personally go with this one as we agreed she'd be a blonde and i like this texture more than the first yellowy one

really phydur yikes ? that was meant as a joke tongue but mm the bgi do have green as a recurrent color.

Last edited by Samer (5/7/11 23:40)


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#46 5/7/11 23:48

Lithium
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Hmm maybe it's the dress color.

And yeah that shade of color looks better

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#47 6/7/11 0:23

Lukas Kreator
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

I think orange is good. And yeah, you cannot please everyone, but that is not a big problem because you can give her other hair color for the other outfit.

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#48 6/7/11 2:28

Samer
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

again oxe dress color same as dark litria's sketch,
the main color will be blond maybe that orange but less orangey, and as a bonus i'll include the browns and green as bonus txmp, example TXMP_head_green if one doesn't like the blonde, he can delete it form the package and rename one of the colors he likes to TXMPbgi_boss_head

this is the final look m going to use as main look
Oni%2525202011-07-06%25252011-25-07-85_cr.jpg
those eyelashes were pissing me off

Last edited by Samer (6/7/11 3:30)


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#49 6/7/11 6:18

Delano762
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

Now everything is absolutely perfect, and the colour of hair is up to you, I don't really care about it, because they all look awesome enough.

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#50 6/7/11 7:37

Yoriko
Member

Re: Female BGI Boss pre-package-release discussion.

We got too many characters with brown or dark hair, only the civilian females are blondes. (and jamie)
I think you should make her blonde, the orange looks good too smile


-I noticed that the hackers of oni community made a lot of modifications before they locked me up, do you have any idea what they want with an old game? -Modifications? What kind of modifications?
-Hard to tell, without getting a look at things but it looks like they're repurposing it. -Why?
-Beats me, all the game has is brutal melee combat and furious gunplay. -I dont like the sound of that.....

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