Mukade

Mukade · 10/17/11 20:10

You're right about the Ninja's probably not being cybernetic, but I think the community has sort of settled on Mukade being cyborg. I'm not sure if there was some sort of concrete reason, but I go with it ^_^

Yoriko · 10/18/11 11:10

There's nothing that indicates any of the ninja being cyborgs, regarding the spikes on the back: I saw an illustration somewhere were it explained the spikes purpose. They get better aerodynamic and can turn faster when running.
I believe I found the illustration in Jon God's library. I think Mukade is just very mutated from the chrysalis, he's been affected of it for such a long time that he's become crazy, why shouldnt it have affected his body aswell? The full covering body armour could be to hide his mutation.

Last edited by Yoriko (10/18/11 11:10)

RuthgerMiles · 10/18/11 15:10

Yoriko wrote:

There's nothing that indicates any of the ninja being cyborgs, regarding the spikes on the back: I saw an illustration somewhere were it explained the spikes purpose. They get better aerodynamic and can turn faster when running.
I believe I found the illustration in Jon God's library. I think Mukade is just very mutated from the chrysalis, he's been affected of it for such a long time that he's become crazy, why shouldnt it have affected his body aswell? The full covering body armour could be to hide his mutation.

Yes, i've read somewhere that the spikes on ninja's backs where some sort of power supplies?(if they are cyborgs) but then again you can see some skin at the normal ones! Also only the green and red have them

Iritscen · 10/18/11 17:10

See previous page of this thread ^_^ Also http://wiki.oni2.net/File:Okita_-_Ninja_2.JPG

Yoriko · 10/18/11 19:10

Ah, that's the picture I was talking about
Why would Mukade be a cyborg anyway?

RuthgerMiles · 10/19/11 05:10

Yoriko wrote:

Ah, that's the picture I was talking about
Why would Mukade be a cyborg anyway?

probably not a cyborg. Just mutilated by the chrysalis i think, same as for barabas! I find it somewhat frustrating that bungie west isnt gonna expand the game, or give the engine free so that ppl here can develop it faster and easier..

Mukade · 10/19/11 16:10

@Ruthgar - If it's been said once it's been said a thousand times, Bungie West doesn't own the rights to Oni anymore, Take 2 does. Although your conclusion still applies probably.

One of the things I don't understand is people are saying the Mukade is just mutated from the chrysalis, and we KNOW that Barabas is. I'm just wondering why they would be mutated when Mai and Muro aren't even though they were the first Chrysali made. "We had only made two prototypes based on the genetic code from you and your brother -"

Did the Syndicate experiment with the Daodan technology once they raided Hasegawa's lab, and create a faster mutating Chrysalis or what? Then again, I suppose if they were subjected to constant stress, not enough to overload the adapting capabilites of the chrysalis, but enough to speed up the process to make them mutate earlier, then I suppose it would be possible. But that's speculation, anyone have an actual answer?

Yoriko · 10/19/11 16:10

Wait what? So Mukade and Barabas arent chrysalis symbiotes?

Iritscen · 10/19/11 16:10

As you said, if later symbiotes like Mukade and Barabas were subjected to more stress, it might explain why they mutated sooner. That being said, neither Mukade nor Barabas are as advanced a symbiote as Muro is, considering Muro's abilities once he transforms.

I think people speculate that Mukade is mutated simply because he wears a mask (never mind that all the ninjas do, and that it's a ninja custom from real history). Since we don't see Mukade's face and have no evidence that he has transformed, let's focus on Barabas, who has clearly mutated to some degree That may be a result of the Daodan Chrysalis in him being "secondhand", copied from Muro's or just not as high-quality as the original two. But since his appearance is basically a lesser version of Mutant Muro's, it seems safe to say that Barabas was close to achieving Imago, assuming he was capable of it.

Mukade · 10/19/11 16:10

Personally, I think he did reach his Imago state. As you say, it was probably made by analysing Muro's Chrysalis and using secondhand information obtained from Hasegawa's lab. Understandably, it would be lesser. Also, it might have something to do with the length of the process. Muro's took longer obviously, and that might also be a factor in his greater ability.

Iritscen · 10/19/11 17:10

Actually there's been some speculation that Muro could transform all along. Why else would he be so confident in his confrontation with Konoko that he was about to show her the full power of the Chrysalis? Seems like he triggered it at will....

Anyway, I should take back my statement that we don't have any evidence that Mukade had transformed. I guess I meant "transformed fully". Obviously he has some amazing powers which could indicate he is in the Imago stage; at the same time, he doesn't have the impenetrable shield that Muro gains when he transforms, and neither does Barabas, so I considered them to be in an imperfect or unfinished state of transformation. Unless Muro just happens to get that handy shield out of luck, and it's not an automatic trait of an Imago Daodan host.

Mukade · 10/19/11 17:10

I'm pretty sure every Imago is unique. Muro obtained his shield and telekinetic powers, Barabas gained Regeneration, and Mukade gained Teleportation. I'm fairly certain the Devil Star is only a weapon, same with his invisilibility (rechargeable phase cloak), both of which are integrated into his armor, I believe.

As for Muro being able to trigger his transformation, it certainly is an interesting thought, but I'd say it's more likely that he simply knew that he was going to transform, he could probably feel it, and perhaps he could contain it temporarily, in order to transform on queue
But being able to trigger it seems unlikely, it's not something you control.

Iritscen · 10/19/11 18:10

I can't argue the last point because there's really no for/against evidence. I'll just say that controlled, reversible transformations are most in keeping with the animé influence, and the most desirable situation in the event of a sequel.

But I always thought that each of the three bosses had two Daodan powers: Barabas had Earthquake and Regeneration, Mukade had the Devil Star and Teleportation (the cloak is definitely his suit, you can see him activating it IIRC), and Muro had his Pushmi-Pullyu and force field.

Mukade · 10/19/11 19:10

Mmmmyeah, I suppose Devil Star would be a Daodan power, if they wanted to display it as a weapon, it wouldn't have been 1 pixel

@Reversible Transformations: I've actually only ever seen one animé show: Claymore, and reversible transformations actually did end up playing a significant role in that

I'm actually hoping to make another attempt at a written sequel. I have so many ideas bouncing around in my head, that I'm going to eventually find the time and motivation to write down, and reversible transformation seems like something I could try and incorporate. Actually, I picture Mai going Imago right after last level, but you see her again in the end cutscene, normal as ever, so learning to revert might be something to consider adding. Her Daodan Latency was getting pretty high, and it wouldn't be accurate if she didn't turn at around the same time Muro did.

Last edited by Mukade (10/19/11 19:10)

RuthgerMiles · 10/20/11 16:10

Btw what happened after you defeat muro, the proccessors are destroyed and the whole world s destroyed init ?

Yoriko · 10/20/11 17:10

Not really, the citys atmosphere is poisonious, Muro reversed the effect of the atmospheric proccessors. (the machines that treats the air before it hits the city) The only way for humanity to survive the radiated air is if everyone gets a chrysalis, but on the other hand the chrysalis will change them all. Mai says in the end: "Mankind as we know it is doomed, the chrysalis will change us all, let's hope it's for the better"

Mukade · 10/20/11 18:10

Yoriko, I think you have it a little wrong. Basically, when Konoko is hitting those last consoles, she's learning about Muro's endgame, and the very last console you get , you see she is inputting some data. See, the dish is a satelite uplink I believe hooked up to 417 of the atmospheric processors (I don't know how many there are total). It was too late for her to stop the process, so instead she inputs some really high info, and the computer warns her that those numbers, when fed into the processors, would overload them, causing them to explode. So when the dish started transmitting, it blew up 417 of the atmospheric processors.

So when she said in the final cutscene "When I blew the processors I bought us some time" she means that if Muro's plan had been allowed to happen, the air would have been poisoned 10x faster, but when she blew them up, she crippled their ability to reprocess the air, and so doomed mankind anyways. However, I think she believes that with furthur work on the chrysalis, some of mankind could be saved.

RuthgerMiles · 10/21/11 03:10

So basically it a bad ending ?:D

Iritscen · 10/21/11 06:10

Well, sort of. But ultimately it depends on how the Chrysalis thing turns out. There's a wee problem with the idea of giving everyone Chrysalises if you consider what happened to Muro (in the killed-Griffin scenario).

RuthgerMiles · 10/21/11 07:10

Indeed, and how the heck do you wanna implant the whole world with the crysalis before most of the people die!? and what would have happened with the WCG?

Also have you guys from here ever contacted take2 about giving Oni back to this community ?

Last edited by RuthgerMiles (10/21/11 07:10)

Mukade · 10/21/11 11:10

As Irit said, sort of, but on the other hand, it could have ended worse. And I'm pretty sure uber super powers were an unintended side effect, Hasegawa and Kerr developped it so they could adapt to the increasingly inhospitable world, not so that they could be super powered

And yes, I'm pretty sure it's been done on a few occasions Ruthgar

Yoriko · 10/21/11 17:10

I'm pretty confident that more people will surrender to the chrysalis like Mukade did

I wonder where BGI is in all of this. I also wonder if Muro had implanted chrysalises in more of his followers to make them stand the new world. Perhaps he had contained a buckload of test subjects before his demise.

Mukade · 10/21/11 23:10

The BGI is simply a syndicate Front as Mai said early in the game. They might be a there own company or whatnot, but they are run, or at least answer to, the syndicate.
And yeah, I think he probably did have a facility dedicated to developping Daodan technology

RuthgerMiles · 10/22/11 07:10

BGI is an organisation from the WCG in secret

Mukade · 10/22/11 09:10

Eh? Well that doesn't make a lick of sense O_o
"Musashi is owned by BGI. According to your latest report, BGI is a suspected Syndicate front"
Obviously, Muro had tight connections with Musashi, and therefore, almost certainly BGI as well.

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