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#1 4/3/07 18:49

tyvol
Member

Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Great forum!

Well, here goes...

I have just purchased the latest Mac version of Oni (1.36).

It installed fine and it works fine in Mac OS X in every respect, except that my mouse freezes up and it takes a while to unfreeze it while playing the game.

It is impossible to improvise around this condition.

I'm running a Mac PowerPC Quad (4 x 2.5 processors) with Mac OS X 10.4.8

I'm using a Kensington Expert Trackball when it freezes.

Just for fun I replaced it with a Kensington Turbo Mouse - same problem.:/

I also tried running OniDM just in case that might help, but it didn't...

I'm willing to try any input device to get rid of this freezing problem (or do the proper hex editing if that's whats needed).

Any thoughts, guidance or pointers?

TIA

tyvol

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#2 4/3/07 19:11

EdT
Moderator

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

tyvol:  What resolution are you playing Oni?  Check the setting in the options menu. Aiko had a similar problem and it was resolved by trying different resolutions.

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#3 4/3/07 20:36

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Hello EdT!

I very much appreciate your prompt response!

Good question!

I tried the following:
    16 x   480 at 16 and 32 bit.
  800 x   500 ditto
  800 x   600 ditto
  960 x   600 ditto
1024 x   768 ditto
1920 x 1200 ditto

I also tried medium to low Quality and the Gamma was set to mid point.

My graphics board is a 7800 GTX with 512mb of VRAM with a HD LCD display, both supporting Core Image.

My Mac OS X System Preferences for my display are set to 1920 x 1200 (millions) so I tried a few other resolution combinations (w/thousands instead of millions of colors).

I also removed my Kensington Mouseworks control panel software and tried running Oni.

The result, as far as I could tell, there was very little difference.

The mouse (x and y axis) continued to freeze solid (while all other keys and buttons still worked) and then, after a few seconds, work properly again. The cycle repeats itself.

I even tried to run the earlier version of Oni (that came on the hard disk) in Classic, and the mouse froze there as well, but it was interesting that the "thaw period" seemed less (or maybe it was just my hope).

Wierd, huh?

At this point I'll try anything...

Thanks again!

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#4 4/3/07 21:17

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

tyvol, since you said "I have just purchased the latest Mac version of Oni (1.36)."
and didn't mention downloading OMNI's OS X port, please confirm it's the port smile
(then again, you mentioned DM, so that's OMNI's port for sure...)

We (SFeLi and myself) have only had a close look at the keyboard mapping, since that was a common problem.
Yours seems weird indeed... and we may not know enough of Mac hardware to figure out what your problem is.

One thing you can always do is bind aiming/turning action to keyboard keys... that's a last resort though sad
Then again, it gets you pretty close to the experience of playing Oni with a gamepad... some would die for it smile


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#5 4/3/07 22:31

EdT
Moderator

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

tyvol: Can you recall what you were doing when the mouse froze?  For example: rapidly pressing the mouse button, moving the mouse quickly, etc.  I recall reading somewhere about an issue with the mouse acceleration, but I can't remember where or the details... maybe it will come to me...

Try looking at the mouse settings in your System preferences and make some adjustments.  Also, do you have a mouse that is not by Kensington?

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#6 4/3/07 23:32

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

EdT and geyser,

Many thanks (!) for trying to help me.

I'm most grateful!

(1) I did download OMNI's OS X Port (after purchasing the 1.1 version directly from Feral) to get it to 1.36 (for Mac OS X).

(2) The DM version is indeed what I'm using.

(2) The mouse freezes no matter what I do (no pressing of the mouse button or moving the mouse quickly seems to make any difference that I can see), it then thaws out, then freezes again (for a while). The enemies (not always to their succes) pounce around the freeze point.

(3) Someone did indeed comment that mouse acceleration (which is needed by Oni) is not supported the same way in OS X as it was in Classic. That may be true (I don't know) but mouse acceleration of the cursor is indeed supported by Kensington (under Mac OS X and Classic).

(4) Sorry to say, I do not yet have a mouse or track ball that is not a "Kensington.":|

Please keep the recommendations coming.

There has to be a way!

Cheers,

tyvol

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#7 9/3/07 20:03

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

SFeLi's only suggestion was to try and set the variable li_center_cursor to 1 from the console
Unfortunately, li_center_cursor, too, is only registered in the PC version, so no dice X(

So, no reason to thank us tyvol, as far as you're concerned we pretty much suck neutral

Try other mice and other Macs. That's all I can suggest, apart from the last resort.
Playing Oni without a mouse is definitely possible, but it might take some practice.

Last edited by geyser (9/3/07 20:04)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#8 28/3/07 12:19

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

EdT & geyser,

A little progress to report.

I did try the standard Apple Mouse but the freezing problem remained.

Under Options, I cut back the Quality Bar to the middle.

I deinstalled the Kensington Trackball System Preferences from the Preference Pane folder (called Mouseworks).

Set the colors to 256 and now Oni runs with only minimal "freezing" points.

That is, after no mouse movement moments, it unfreezes very quickly (now I can play the game without too much of a handicap).

This sound like or point to anything anyone has seen before?

Cheers,

tyvol

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#9 28/3/07 21:32

EdT
Moderator

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

tyvol: Can you post the contents of the startup.txt file in the Oni Folder.
Perhaps that can give us a clue.

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#10 31/3/07 13:01

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Well, here goes the post of the startup.txt file...

begin initializing oni
looking for the game data folder
initializing the template manager
DataFolder = GameDataFolder
Created a file iterator for the data folder.
Got Level Info for level0_Final.dat.
Valid Level level0_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level10_Final.dat.
Valid Level level10_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level11_Final.dat.
Valid Level level11_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level12_Final.dat.
Valid Level level12_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level13_Final.dat.
Valid Level level13_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level14_Final.dat.
Valid Level level14_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level18_Final.dat.
Valid Level level18_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level19_Final.dat.
Valid Level level19_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level1_Final.dat.
Valid Level level1_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level2_Final.dat.
Valid Level level2_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level3_Final.dat.
Valid Level level3_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level4_Final.dat.
Valid Level level4_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level6_Final.dat.
Valid Level level6_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level8_Final.dat.
Valid Level level8_Final.dat
Got Level Info for level9_Final.dat.
Valid Level level9_Final.dat
calling TMrRegisterTemplates
calling ONrRegisterTemplates
initializing oni platform specific code
initializing sound system 2, basic level
initializing basic sound system 2 layer...
initializing oni persistance
initializing scripting
initializing binary data system
initializing imaging
initializing image system...
initializing motoko
initializing 3D display system..
initializing geometry engines...
initializing draw engines...
initializing physics
initializing oni motoko
initializing local input
initializing input system...
initializing animation system
initializing animation system...
initializing environment
initializing text system
initializing the console
initializing the materials
initializing the full sound system 2
initializing full sound system 2...
initializing particle 3
initializing oni particle 3
initializing env particle system
initializing physics
initializing game state
initializing AI 2
initializing window manager
initializing film system
initializing level
initializing oni scripting
initializing OBDr
initializing OBJr
initializing oni cinematics
initializing oni sound
initializing oni movie
initializing the pause screen
finished oni initializing
loading level 0...
setting up 3d engine...
creating new OpenGL context
OpenGL platform initialization
Attempting resolution change to 1920x1200x32
OpenGL vendor = NVIDIA Corporation
OpenGL renderer = NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT OpenGL Engine
OpenGL version = 1.5 NVIDIA-1.4.18
OpenGL extensions = GL_ARB_transpose_matrix GL_ARB_vertex_program GL_ARB_vertex_blend GL_ARB_window_pos GL_ARB_shader_objects GL_ARB_vertex_shader GL_EXT_multi_draw_arrays GL_EXT_clip_volume_hint GL_EXT_rescale_normal GL_EXT_draw_range_elements GL_EXT_fog_coord GL_APPLE_client_storage GL_APPLE_specular_vector GL_APPLE_transform_hint GL_APPLE_packed_pixels GL_APPLE_fence GL_APPLE_vertex_array_object GL_APPLE_vertex_program_evaluators GL_APPLE_element_array GL_APPLE_flush_render GL_NV_texgen_reflection GL_NV_light_max_exponent GL_IBM_rasterpos_clip GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap GL_ARB_shading_language_100 GL_ARB_imaging GL_ARB_point_parameters GL_ARB_texture_env_crossbar GL_ARB_texture_border_clamp GL_ARB_multitexture GL_ARB_texture_env_add GL_ARB_texture_cube_map GL_ARB_texture_env_dot3 GL_ARB_multisample GL_ARB_texture_env_combine GL_ARB_texture_compression GL_ARB_texture_mirrored_repeat GL_ARB_shadow GL_ARB_depth_texture GL_ARB_fragment_program GL_ARB_fragment_shader GL_ARB_occlusion_query GL_ARB_point_sprite GL_ARB_vertex_buffer_object GL_ARB_pixel_buffer_object GL_EXT_compiled_vertex_array GL_EXT_framebuffer_object GL_EXT_texture_rectangle GL_ARB_texture_rectangle GL_EXT_texture_env_add GL_EXT_blend_color GL_EXT_blend_minmax GL_EXT_blend_subtract GL_EXT_texture_lod_bias GL_EXT_abgr GL_EXT_bgra GL_EXT_stencil_wrap GL_EXT_texture_filter_anisotropic GL_EXT_secondary_color GL_EXT_blend_func_separate GL_EXT_shadow_funcs GL_EXT_stencil_two_side GL_EXT_texture_compression_s3tc GL_EXT_texture_compression_dxt1 GL_APPLE_ycbcr_422 GL_APPLE_vertex_array_range GL_APPLE_texture_range GL_APPLE_float_pixels GL_ATI_texture_float GL_APPLE_pixel_buffer GL_NV_point_sprite GL_NV_register_combiners GL_NV_register_combiners2 GL_NV_blend_square GL_NV_texture_shader GL_NV_texture_shader2 GL_NV_texture_shader3 GL_NV_fog_distance GL_NV_depth_clamp GL_NV_multisample_filter_hint GL_NV_fragment_program_option GL_NV_fragment_program2 GL_NV_vertex_program2_option GL_NV_vertex_program3 GL_ATI_texture_env_combine3 GL_SGIS_texture_edge_clamp GL_SGIS_texture_lod 
multitexturing is available ...
multipass being used
OpenGL supports 4 texturing units
Initializing the Oni Window...
displaying splash screen...
configuring console...
Opening movie 'GameDataFolder/intro.bik' ... 
Could get CFString: GameDataFolder/intro.bik
BinkOpen(, 0) -> 0x2438e040
Opening movie 'GameDataFolder/intro.bik' ... 
Could get CFString: GameDataFolder/intro.bik
BinkOpen(, 1073741824) -> 0x2438e040
BKrMovie_Play starting play loop
engine startup complete, launch the out-of-game UI...
out-of-game UI exited...
running game...
game over, unloading level...
beginning exit process...
OpenGL disposed properly
oni exit complete, shutting down...

FWIW, I'm running OS X 10.4.9 on a G5 2.5 Quad with 4.5 GB DDR2 SDRAM and my GPU is a 7800 GTX 512.

With screen saver and Kensington Mouseworks disabled and running the display in 256 colors (but with the game in 1920 x 1200 32 bit), I still get mouse sticking points, but they unfreeze fairly quickly.

HTH...

Cheers,

tyvol

Last edited by TomeOne (9/8/11 10:49)

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#11 5/4/07 12:17

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

EdT should know better, but I don't think tyvol's problem has been reported before.

As for the freezing/sticking, I wonder if it's specific to the mouse and to what extent it's connected with graphics.
It's worth it to try and play Oni without a mouse (e.g., bind the arrow keys to directional aiming and turning).
Specifically, I'm curious whether freezing still occurs when the mouse is at rest, i.e., if it's caused by the mouse.

Since the freezing seems to some extent related to graphic modes (whatever that means), I suggest the following.

1) tyvol, you can try and run the version of the OS X port known as the Intel fix (news from 2006/08/26 on edt.oni2.net)

2) Another thing that is well worth trying in your case, tyvol, is to run Oni in -noswitch mode. See HERE


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#12 5/4/07 12:30

Tosh
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Hm...
Well is it a wireless mouse? Mine has a sleep mode where you have to click it to reactivate it, it normally only goes into sleep mode if it's idle for so long; but if this is the case for yours it could be bugged or the idle time could be set low.

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#13 5/4/07 13:05

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

He tried with a standard issue mouse and the problem persisted.
And it doesn't "freeze" by lack of input, rather the other way round.

Last edited by geyser (5/4/07 13:08)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#14 5/4/07 17:54

EdT
Moderator

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Aiko had a problem with her mouse freezing after she upgraded to OSX 10.4.8, but when she changed the resolution to 1920 x 1200 that solved her problem.

So I'm out of ideas at the moment.

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#15 5/4/07 18:07

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

when she changed the resolution to 1920 x 1200 that solved her problem.

So I'm out of ideas at the moment.

Depending on the GFX hardware, there might be a difference between running in 1920x1200 the usual way and in 1920x1200 with -noswitch.
Technically, they are different graphical modes. So definitely, tyvol, try that.
And the "Intel fix". Makes sense even if you don't have an Intel Mac. Just like the "XP patch" has little to do with XP as such smile


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#16 19/4/07 17:05

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Much obliged for your thinking and suggestions on this!

Well, this is getting interesting...

My USB connected mouse still freezes, but I think you’ve got me a bit closer.

First (good thought, Tosh), I checked the idle time options on the mouse (a trackball) and I disabled scrolling and then messed around with speeds and such, specific to the Oni application and generally. No difference that I could tell no matter what I did, but now that potential cause is a bit farther out of the way.

I now have several versions of Oni (for OS/9, Oni for OSX, Oni for OSX Development Mode and Oni for OSX w/an Intel Fix) and my mouse intermittently hangs in each of them. And, you are correct, geyser, the more input the mouse gets, the more it seems to want to hang. To play the game, I must move the Oni character with the direction keys (to buy time against opponents) until the mouse unfreezes. A real pain…

I've run all these versions at most resolutions, but I now keep it, as you suggest EdT, at 1920 x 1200 (32 bit).

The Oni version for OSX w/Intel Fix seems to work best on my PowerPC because absolutely everything in Developer (Ultra) Mode (i.e., "killmequick" followed by other commands) works just beautifully as described elsewhere. Many thanks, geyser for suggesting this version for that reason alone.

With the Intel Fix version of Oni, the mouse still freezes, however, whether I'm using the Kensington Mouseworks software or not (this software manages my Kensington Expert Mouse trackball preferences).

I was also able to run the OSX w/Intel Fix version in a window using the -noswitch feature (neat, actually), but alas, no joy, the mouse still freezes/sticks.

So, I've come to the conclusion (!) that the Kensington software is not a factor by itself and, because I’ve had the freeze/sticking problem with the Kensington trackball and a standard Apple mouse (with all USB hubs bypassed with each mouse, connecting them directly to the PPC), they are probably not the problem, either.

Any suggestions are welcome, but I'd like to pursue one or more of the issues you nicely clarified above, geyser, namely:

(1) Is the freezing/sticking specific to the mouse…?
If I can bind the arrow keys to directional aiming and turning and freezing still occurred, this would eliminate the mouse (if I unplug the mouse first so that it cannot be a factor even at rest). I assume the arrow keys can be changed in the key_config.txt file and any help here would be appreciated.

(2) Or is it connected with graphics?
Now this seems to be where the issue just might be. I say this because when running Oni before the game starts or a save point is loaded, the mouse never sticks. It seems to me that if Oni can run most of the time in the game with the mouse operating properly, there has to be a way to make it run that way all the time.

Anyway, I wanted to report back to you on your suggestions, which I appreciate.

I’m still looking at all the options I might have in Ultra Mode to narrow things down further.

Many Thanks!

tyvol

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#17 19/4/07 20:32

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

BTW - the trackball freezes (has no effect at all) for a minimum of about 4 seconds but can stay frozen up to 6 seconds (during this time, I have my dancing shoes on...). Then, it works wonderfully for about the same amount of time. Rinse, repeat...

Hm...:/

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#18 20/4/07 5:13

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

late reply: Her name is Konoko. Or Mai Hasegawa. Not Oni smile
Ultra Mode has nothing to do with Developer Mode. It's just that UM is useless, so a lazy hack was to shortcut the UM cheat to DM.
Dev Mode won't give you access to any extra settings relevant to your problem as far as I can tell.

Please confirm that with no mouse/trackball input at all, input doesn't freeze at all.
That is, bind turning/aiming actions to something like arrow keys, and play that way.
If you're able to play without touching the mouse and experience no freezing:
A) that could be good enough. PS2 folks play that way all the time.
B) that would mean that you don't have to unplug the mouse smile
C) which is lucky, because unplugging the mouse from the Mac just to play Oni... is... well... even less convenient than playing Oni without a mouse in the first place

More late replies, to both your points above

(1) Is the freezing/sticking specific to the mouse…?
If I can bind the arrow keys to directional aiming and turning and freezing still occurred, this would eliminate the mouse (if I unplug the mouse first so that it cannot be a factor even at rest). I assume the arrow keys can be changed in the key_config.txt file and any help here would be appreciated.

(2) Or is it connected with graphics?
Now this seems to be where the issue just might be. I say this because when running Oni before the game starts or a save point is loaded, the mouse never sticks. It seems to me that if Oni can run most of the time in the game with the mouse operating properly, there has to be a way to make it run that way all the time.

(1) I've repeatedly linked to the key binding documentation on the wiki. It's HERE

(2) Not being familiar at all with Mac hardware and software, I have no idea what the problem could be in your specific case and how it can be solved.
I proposed to try the "Intel Fix" because you reported improvement when reducing GFX quality from within Oni etc.
The Intel Fix is GFX-related, so that's why I suggested it. Same for -noswitch. So I've run out of ideas, sorry.
Problem is probably not "with Oni". Something odd with your Mac rig, hardware or software or both. Dunno.

Last edited by geyser (20/4/07 11:01)


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#19 20/4/07 10:45

EdT
Moderator

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

tyvol: One more thing you could try.  Create a new user account in OSX and log in to that account and then try playing Oni.  A fresh account will not have any extra extensions, system preferences and so on, which might account for the freezing mouse.

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#20 20/4/07 15:25

tyvol
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Thanks EdT for the notion to try a new user account to simplify things (good idea), but alas, same old freezing occurs.

I’m thinking that geyser is correct, in that this issue is the result of something on my end (something to do with my particular rig and or its settings).

That being said, I’d like to do exactly as you suggest, geyser, and bind the arrow keys to the horizontal/vertical aiming “events,” and run Oni without touching the mouse/trackball at all.

I’ve attempted this from your previous link to the customizing/binding info on the wiki, but because there are four arrow keys and apparently only two aim syntax settings (horizontal: aim_lr or aim_LR and vertical: aim_ud or aim_UD) I couldn’t make it work. I’m obviously missing something.
[I did take out the other bind statements for the arrow keys later on in the updated key_config.txt file.]

Note: In my unsatisfactory attempt to get this to work, I did get the uparrow and rightarrow keys to work, making Konoko (!) “aim” up and turn right all the way around (and around). Guess what, no freezing…

So, more specifically, the help I need here is some guidance as to how I bind the uparrow key to the UP aim function only, and so on with the other three arrow keys.

I will immediately test and report.

TIA!

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#21 20/4/07 18:02

Tosh
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Well, I dunno about aiming down but I got the other three.
bind rightarrow to turnright
bind uparrow to aim_UD
bind leftarrow to turnleft

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#22 20/4/07 18:16

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

left and right you can bind to turnleft and turnright.
That means you won't be able to run in one direction while aiming in another, but I don't know many people who indulge in that feature (lookmode) in combat.
That should have you completely set for melee fighting, as up/down aiming is not functional then. You'll be ready to enjoy some DOOM-style melee smile

In order to use weapons... heh. I guess I lied to you and to myself about UP/DOWN aiming being keyboard-bindable.
There's no clear fix to that. At least not something that wouldn't involve hacking and prior investigation on our side.
What you can do, though... is just rely on auto-aiming when on an even ground with the enemy: works with most guns.
When and if you need to aim high or low, grab the mouse. When it freezes, let it rest and switch to turnleft/turnright.

Should be manageable. And you can be proud to be the only guy who gets to play PS2-style on the Mac big_smile


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#23 20/4/07 18:21

Tosh
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

I haven't tried it, wouldn't really know how, but do you think there's a way you could bind cutscene2 to it and then have a global script with cutscene2 in it which will just make you look down? It could even just snap your view all the way down, and you could adjust the angle by looking up. tongue
I dunno if there's a script command for changing where you're looking, though, and am too lazy to look it up at the moment. Heh. ^^;

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#24 20/4/07 18:32

geyser
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

"cutscene" hotkeys trigger whole animations, and animations are unrelated to aiming, except for aiming-screen stuff, which can't be applied with "cutscene" hotkeys (sounds like a conspiracy, eh?).
Scripting is a no-go, too. Nothing of that kind out there.


Behold the power of that which is yet unborn! For the swirling images that flow forth from the Chrysalis are only a shadow of the sleeper's true power.

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#25 20/4/07 21:13

Tosh
Member

Re: Mac Mouse Freezes Up?

Ah darn, I was thinking those called a cutscene function.

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